Disney shares more looks at its next hotel

This looks incredibly generic and follows the recent design aesthetics from DVC resorts that sanitize and dress down iconic WDW resorts. Will Disney ever build another resort on the scale and iconic designs of the Grand Floridian, Contemporary, AKL, Poly, or Wilderness Lodge again?

My understanding is that not only does this resort look like nothing more than your run of the mill Hilton, but it reportedly does not have its own access road with guests needing to drive through/around Wilderness Lodge or Fort Wilderness to reach the property.

Also, let's not forget that this site will have been in development for nearly a decade after it was first announced in 2018 for an original 2022 opening. COVID clearly took its toll on this project, but 9 years to open a DVC resort should tell you all you need to know about the program and the slowing of resort demand at WDW since 2020.

I don't think the design looks bad, but it does look like these areas could get slammed with guests. Even the firework viewing concept art looks like too many people crowded around not enough room.

@Russell: To your point about the recent, generic DVC themes -- I wonder if this is a hedge by Disney. I don't think the likelihood of this happening is all that high, but if Disney ever wanted to divest of DVC & spin it off as its own entity, or get Marriott/Hilton/Hyatt/Wyndham etc to run it, it would be much easier to do so with generic "hotel" themes vs. elaborate theming a la Animal Kingdom Lodge.

I read it as DisneyWorm

That bar looks a lot like the bar at Cotino. I agree that it's becoming difficult to distinguish the recent Disney resort projects.

"I agree that it's becoming difficult to distinguish the recent Disney resort projects."

Not only that, but everything that they've built at WDW over the past 20 years has been DVC aside from the Coronado Springs tower, which is an expansion of an existing resort. The last truly "new" non-DVC resort is Art of Animation, which was technically built and intended to open as part of Pop Century back in 2003, but didn't actually open until 2012. I get it that DVC facilitates and expedites the expansion of inventory, but regular WDW guests haven't had a truly new resort since the Eisner era.

@Russell: Why wouldn’t DVC owners be regarded as "regular WDW guests"?

@TH - Because they're a different class of WDW guest since they are already invested in taking regular vacations at Disney resorts (including WDW). DVC guests have skin in the game, and because of their "ownership" (FWIW, DVC is very different from other timeshares in that owners' stake sunsets after a term - typically 50 years), have a very different connection to the company than a guest not invested in DVC. Also, it's common for DVC owners to hold APs and receive other discounts at WDW, so when they make visits to Orlando, it's not that same as a regular WDW guest. While DVC resorts are not necessarily "exclusive", non-DVC guests do have to go through some extra hoops to stay at DVC resorts (if they even know how to book a DVC room), so if you assume that DVC owners make up a minority of guests at WDW, they certainly don't visit or behave like a majority of the visitors to WDW, including local APs.

Russell; "...so if you assume that DVC owners make up a minority of guests at WDW ..."

Me: While we are making assumptions, "if we assume" that a majority of Disney guests don't stay in Disney rooms during their visit to WDW property, and we reasonably define "regular guests" based on frequency of visits -- as in, "I'm a regular customer" -- then it seems to me that DVC members actually exemplify the model of a Disney regular guest.

In which case, prioritizing DVC resort construction is not worthy of snide comments, but rather praise for a wise business choice.

Disney is making smart decisions, Russell. It's weak that you can't acknowledge that.

I never said it wasn't a smart decision for Disney, but that doesn't mean it's a smart decision for us as customers. DVC is guaranteed revenue for the company, and continuing to cater to that business model helps defer expansion costs that would take a decade to recoup as a standard resort hotel. However, as a customer who does not see value in the program, and in fact has seen friends and acquaintances have negative experiences with DVC after years of ownership, I think it's worthwhile to point out the drawbacks of the program from the customer side of the equation. I also think it's important to note Disney's continued investment in DVC while virtually ignoring non-DVC guests over the past 2 decades, and how much less the company appears to care about WDW visitors who have chosen to not own DVC, but still spend significant sums on visits.

Russell: : I also think it's important to note Disney's continued investment in DVC while virtually ignoring non-DVC guests over the past 2 decades, and how little the company appears to care about those who have chosen to not own DVC."

Me: You are absolutely dodging my point! DVC members are 100% "regular" guests. Without question they are the customers that show up! You are framing the situation as a critism of the company's development decisions.

@Russell: And by the way, Disney has invested massive amounts of money renovating its resorts. You even acknowledged the construction of the Coronado Springs tower.

OK, so maybe the term "regular" guest isn't the best wording with "average" perhaps more concise in describing what I mean with my analysis. The fact of the matter is that DVC owners are in a different class from most other WDW guests because of their investment into the company. Here is how I would categorize the different types of WDW guests...

1. Once in a lifetime - These are the people that visit WDW once or maybe twice over the course of their lifetime (50+ years), and see a WDW vacation as a bucket list trip. They may have been to WDW once as a child, and want to give their children that same unique experience as parents, or want to give their kids the vacation they never had as a child. These guests probably make up a larger percentage of visitors than some may realize, because they're making one-off visits and don't necessarily make waves when the experience doesn't meet (or maybe even exceeds) expectations and won't bat an eyelash at spending a bit extra on something they'll never have a chance to do again.

2. Milestone visitors - These are the guests that visit frequently, but not at regular intervals. Milestone visitors learn their way around WDW and will make visits based on events, whether that be special family occasions (anniversaries, important birthdays, weddings, graduations, reunions, etc...) and/or may even be linked to major additions to the parks. I tend to think this class makes up a plurality of guests visiting WDW.

3. Frequent visitors - These are the guests that make routine trips to the parks every 2-3 years that are more likely tied to park additions and special events. These guests have intimate knowledge of the parks/resorts, but don't necessarily default to a Disney vacation every single year. I think the frequent and milestone visitors make up a majority of guests at WDW, and represent what I would call a "regular/average" guest. They spend a decent amount of money on Disney vacations, but are not so invested in the company that they're spending a significant percentage of their disposable income on trips to WDW (this is the type of guest I would categorize myself as).

4. APs - This class has some overlap between the class above and the class below mostly depending on where you live. Obviously if you live near the parks, you're probably going to invest in an AP if you have any affinity towards spending entertainment dollars on Disney experiences. You also might buy an AP as a frequent visitor because even a non-Florida resident AP may offer a better value than a standard multi-day admission (if you plan on spending more than 15 days in WDW in a single year, an AP is usually a better value). APs have a vested interest in the parks, but it's more of a short term interest because APs are renewable/cancelable each year.

5. DVC Owners - This class has put their money where their mouth is, and have chosen to invest tens of thousands of dollars into the Disney vacation ecosystem. This level of investment means they're taking at least a week-long Disney vacation (most often to WDW) every single year for at least half their life. DVC guests have an engrained fanaticism and interest in WDW because they've contractually obligated to invest tens of thousands of dollars in the program up front, and as such don't visit WDW or approach a WDW trip in the same way as most guests staying in a non-DVC room (whether that's onsite or offsite). As such, I don't see DVC-owners as a "regular/average" guest, but I do think Disney is working to normalize DVC ownership to the point where this class might eventually become the most common way guests vacation in Disney parks. I think this is why Disney has continued to invest in the program to the detriment of non-DVC resorts. I also think that's one of the reasons why the recent "small ball" additions were implemented to satiate these types of guests that spend a week or more in the parks every single year, and while Disney has already earned these customers' business and long term commitment, the consistent satisfaction of DVC owners is needed to build word of mouth to expand ownership and sell all the new units they've built and those coming online in the coming years. I frankly wouldn't be surprised to see DVC-owners eventually becoming the dominant class of WDW visitors, which would obviously make Disney very happy from a financial perspective, but would continue to push the needs and desires of non-DVC owners to the side, hence my frustration with Disney's laser-like focus to expand the program - the more Disney commits to DVC, the less the company will care about visitors like me, even though I'm a frequent visitor.

6. VIPs - This class can be highly variable in terms of their visitation frequency, but generally when they come, they go all out. These are the guests who stay on Concierge Levels, buy every upcharge available, and expect to be pampered every second of their stay. Disney has certainly shifted a lot of resources to cater to these types of guests (as many entertainment and travel business have since the Pandemic), and in doing so has created the stratification that we're seeing in various experiences with Disney essentially selling different aspects of what was a traditional VIP experience a la carte to allow those who don't own a yacht and a vacation home in Monte Carlo, but do have the means to spend thousands of dollars on a single day in a theme park to get a taste of the VIP lifestyle. This class of guest has definitely increase over the past 5-10 years, as has Disney's aggressiveness in pursuing more visits from VIPs.

I do realize that Disney has performed major renovations to existing non-DVC resorts and rooms/units, but my point remains that aside from Gran Destino Tower (expansion of Coronado Springs), Disney has not built a single non-DVC unit at WDW since Eisner resigned. Renovations are a necessary part of operating hotels/resorts, and most of what Disney has done to the non-DVC inventory has been mostly modernization of units to meet the expectations of 21st century travelers (updating outdated decor, swapping out tube TVs with flat screens, installing USB plugs, and the like). Let's not even compare the costs of a resort modernization renovation to that of a brand new DVC resort or DVC expansion at an existing resort - those are an order of magnitude different in terms of capital investment. However, even if you do consider the renovations on par with the rapid expansion of DVC (FWIW, Disney has spent plenty to renovate older DVC resorts as well), by not increasing non-DVC inventory, they're signaling that they simply don't care as much about guests who only spend a handful of nights at WDW every few years, and would rather dedicate hundreds of new units to those willing to commit tens of thousands of dollars and decades of annual vacations to WDW - pray to the alter of the Mouse. This all goes back to a general trend with Disney that started just before the Pandemic and has accelerated shortly thereafter where Disney pivoted to court heavy hitters/big spenders far more than more value conscious guests, and beyond the upcharges, stratification of experiences, and other policy changes, you're seeing that major shift in approach exemplified with Disney's almost singular focus on DVC ownership.

Again, there's nothing wrong or stupid about the business decisions behind DVC's expansion. I merely think it's worth highlighting the recent trends that suggest that those of us who enjoy Disney vacations, but are not willing to commit a lifetime of vacations and tens of thousands of dollars to a time share, do not seem to carry the same level of interest from the company that they did a couple of decades ago. "Mongo only pawn in game of life" as Mel Brooks would say, and I find it disappointing that a company that appealed to everyone and was accessible to a large majority of vacationers has turned into a revenue optimization machine that is no longer interested in the needs of those who may not want (or has the means) to spend a week or more inside the Disney vacation ecosystem every year until they die.