Promoting Six Flags - Qiddiya City

I think the issue with this kind of promotion is that it feels inherently sponsored. I mean, all of it is sponsored, but it feels more believable when the Brady Bunch is at your local regional theme park than at the largest and most expensive destination park in the world.

Or maybe all the shows you listed were American and therefore not a great fit for The Middle East.

So you aren't tempted in the least by what may be the most amazing coaster in the world?

The only reason any tv studio would ever go there is if the Saudi Government paid them a lot of money to, and even that is a stretch because it wouldn't be worth the backlash.

There are plenty of amusement parks in the states I don't think anyone is clamoring to go to Saudi Arabia to go to a Six Flags park. I'm sure the theme park influencers like Robert and the Coaster Studios guy will go, other than that this place will be void of westerners and probably will be dead most of the time and lose a lot of money. Personally I will not be going as I don't want to go to Saudi Arabia and there isn't anything special about this park that makes me want to go there (including Falcons Flight..which to me looks pretty lame).

EDIT: TLDR there is no way any American TV show will ever film at this park.

HAHAHAHAHAAH - This is too easy.

"I realized that my integrity was negotiable"

It already was and always will be.... You vote for a clown who paid off a Porn star, Cried Bone Spurs to dodge a draft, Cheated on all of his three wives, won't show his taxes as promised, and Now hide's the Epstein files......

And Don't forget my favorite Fake assignation where he was hit with .223 bullet but it somehow healed in Three days?

The man golfed during Texas flooding. Then showed up a 10 days later. Finally.

But you will know more in Two weeks - Like a new Health care plan, peace plans and Gas that he says is $1.85......

HAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHA

Who is the Fool? The Fool or the man that voted for the Fool?

Integrity? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAH....

"I'm sure the theme park influencers like Robert and the Coaster Studios guy will go, other than that this place will be void of westerners and probably will be dead most of the time and lose a lot of money."

I think that's a really unfair statement. The opening of this park is theme park news, and I think as a source for industry news, TPI is obligated to cover this new park. The question ultimately is how this park is covered and whether Robert (or someone else from TPI) would openly accept an invitation inclusive of travel and expenses to cover this park's opening. I know if I was asked to cover SFQ, I would wrestle with the ethical dilemma that the mere existence of this park represents, but I think I would cover it under the assumption that I would be allowed to provide my full and honest review of the development, which would include how this was funded and cultural differences in this part of the world that may not provide the most glowing review of the place. I would need some assurance that I could express my honest opinion of the place, and even then, I would be concerned that there would still be some who would think that my opinions of the park were "bought". That's really my biggest concern, because no matter how nice the park is or how friendly the operators are, there will be an ingrained bias towards anyone reviewing SFQ.

While I do have ethical issues with what KSA is doing, the world needs to recognize that they're not going anywhere, and will be hosting the World Cup in 2034 and likely will be hosting the Olympics within the next decade. While it's clear they're "buying" these global events, there will be a lot of pressure on the region to become more welcoming to Westerners and to conform to the societal standards accepted by the rest of the world if they want to be taken seriously as a tourist destination. SFQ in that sense (in addition to Riyadh Season) are the cutting edge of what is liable to be a massive investment to remake the global image and perception of KSA just as it's happened over the last decade in the UAE and to a lesser extent Qatar.

Wow! A Brian Emery MAGA rant, and it looks like somebody's prescription medicine needs a refill.

All kidding aside, Brian, you made me smile, and thanks for reminding me why my selection of presidential candidates in the last three elections was limited to Bad and Worse.

And with respect to what Russell said, I'm having trouble understanding my semi-revulsion towards the KSA when the PRC killed millions during the Cultural Revolution, and I got to witness the Tiananmen Square Massacre in news reports, and yet I don't have the same problem with going to Shanghai Disneyland or Universal Studios Beijing. On a bigger scale, in the value set of world opinion, is it worse to kill millions and pro-democracy protestors or dismember journalists and persecute gay people? I just don't know.

I guess I'll have to wait until Lady Gaga does a Six Flags - Qiddiya City concert, and then everything will be okay. (Oh, and Brian Emery starts charging Donald Trump rent for living in his head.)

@Tim Hillman

Oh, I'm tempted to go. But if I had the thousand+ dollars it would take me to get an airplane ticket, park ticket, and hotel room I might as well road trip to cedar point and hit all the biggest coaster parks along the way. Then I could get on TT2 and a ton of other bucket list coasters.

I think you misinterpreted my post. I wasn't trying to criticize Robert for covering this, I think the expectation is that he will and I have no problem with that. It's his job and he's just doing his job. If my job sent me to Saudi Arabia i'd go because its my job.

But other than that why would anyone want to go to Saudi Arabia to go to Six Flags? Is there a big local market for this park? You can make an argument for a regional park but this is clearly being marketed as an international tourist destination, not a regional theme park. Are people in Iraq, Yemen, and Oman wanting to take family vacations to Saudi Arabia Six Flags? Iraq is Iraq and Yemen has been in civil war for like 10 years. It seems to me like there is no market for this resort destination, its just another MBS vanity project that's going to lose a lot of money.

If it does it would be a legendary coaster failure story. The largest, fastest, longest, etc. . .all down the drain because Saudi Arabia thinks they're a tourist destination.

@VelocicoasterFan - That would be the biggest tragedy in the whole situation.

I'd give this park a lifespan of 5-7 years, and then when Disney - Abu Dhabi opens, this place will be come an even emptier ghost town.

Robert probably see the stats. I wonder if he sees much traffic on this site from the Middle East?

I think any thought of this park being promoted to American audiences is probably a faulty premise, because no matter what they do, Americans just aren't likely to travel to the Middle East in large numbers. Instead, I expect a lot of the attention will be on getting visitors from Europe and Asia. The two biggest markets for the UAE outside of the Arab world are India and the United Kingdom, so I fully see Saudi Arabia pitching Riyadh as an alternate to Dubai or Abu Dhabi. It's also important to keep in mind that Qiddiya is far more than Six Flags, but is instead more like a city built for the purpose of being an entertainment destination, with the theme park as one component of it. More or less, Six Flags is to Qiddiya City what the Magic Kingdom is to Walt Disney World.

As for whether I'd personally visit or not, the answer to that is "yes, if it made sense to do so." As impressive as Falcons Flight may be, one roller coaster (or even one park full of several amazing rides) is not justification to travel halfway around the world, and Saudi Arabia as a country is just not somewhere I really have much interest in visiting. However, if I were traveling somewhere else in the Middle East (which, knowing me, would likely be the United Arab Emirates), and both time and budget permitted including a few nights in Riyadh as a stopover, and the visa process wasn't too onerous, then I would very likely include a visit in my plans. Sure, the country has a poor reputation, but it is a highly developed country and there are no specific safety advisories regarding travel to most of it, so I don't feel there is significant risk to visiting. When it comes to the moral and ethical issues, my stance is simple: Every country does things that are considered bad by outsiders, but it is not our place to force others beyond our borders to adhere to our standards. It is up to each person as individuals to decide whether they are or are not okay with visiting a place based on their own evaluation of the situation. I would not judge anyone for choosing not to visit a country with policies they disagree with, nor would I judge anyone who still feels okay with visiting. For me, Saudi Arabia absolutely has policies that I disagree with, but (per my current understanding) those are far more the result of a historically strict adherence to the Islamic religion rather than a corrupt government abusing the population solely for their own benefit, so I'm less likely to avoid the country for those reasons. If the situation changed (or if my understanding of the situation changed), it could definitely affect whether or not I personally would go, but I still wouldn't judge those who went even if I myself wouldn't.

Thanks for a great analysis, AJ!

Any of you lurkers out there have any thoughts on visiting Six Flags - Qiddiya City just to ride this coaster? The usual suspects have chimed in, but what do the rest of you think?

Nope! Not even if you offered to pay for a 1st class flight, put me in the finest penthouse suite, arraigned a private tour of the park, and a ride with the folks who created it. That environment is not for the likes of me.

Well, as a Veteran of this here country - There is No way on Gods green earth I would ever do anything in the Middle East - You might recall 9/11 and where did the hijackers come from....?

Not for me, but i just wonder ... in ??? years will some park, somewhere in the US say, OK it's time to bring those records back to these shores? Especially if Intamin can really pull this off, which so far it does, at least, seem to be able to do a full circuit.

If you were to drop me in via chopper like John Hammond in Jurassic Park and then take me right back out then hell yes I’d go. As a Floridian, going to a park in the desert holds no attraction for me. Ive got enough of my fill here of hellscape temperatures.

For the record, we discussed how to cover SFQ on the board last year: https://www.themeparkinsider.com/discussion/thread.cfm?page=2821

Sometimes you’ve got to kick the tires again, Robert.

I thought about what I posted last December, and I still feel primarily that way, but conditions have changed. Back then, the situation was abstract for me because I was looking at it from the perspective of someone who would never get the opportunity to visit, and I was perfectly fine with a theme park influencer like you or someone else in the industry visiting and reporting the details.

But in the last several months I’ve changed roles at work and could possibly visit the Middle East sometime in the next few years on business. Then I saw the promo video of perhaps the most incredible coaster in the world, and I found myself wanting to visit SF-QC and ride it if I were in the region. (It would have to be a solo trip because my wonderful wife would go all Helen Reddy on the first Saudi man that treated her like a second-class citizen, and we’d both be thrown in prison.)

Now I must look at the situation from a personal perspective, and I feel deeply conflicted over a perceived values conflict. So, I backed into the issue again on this thread to see if others felt the same way. For me, the basic conflict that exists is “Who is normalizing whom?” If westerners go there, are they having an enlightening effect on the country or are we normalizing barbaric behaviors like butchering journalists and torturing people with alternate lifestyles? The rain will probably fall on both sides of the mountain on this issue, but am I on a personal basis overstating the positive effect of exposure to western values on Saudi culture just so I can have a thrill? I’m not so sure that I’m willing to make that psychological walk of shame.

No easy answers on this one, so I think I’m going to go eat that last Oreo in the cookie jar just so I can feel conflicted about something else. It’s going to go stale quickly if I leave it there by itself. Right?

OK so you know the answer

"(It would have to be a solo trip because my wonderful wife would go all Helen Reddy on the first Saudi man that treated her like a second-class citizen, and we’d both be thrown in prison.)"

But you are still willing to go to the Middle East?
ZEOR integrity and values.

Not even for 1 Million Tax free dollars would I go there....

This Vet will never kowtow to the Middle East.

Oil and Blood on their hands.

Brian, I wish I could view the world in black and white like you do, but that is not my reality. I’ve found that if we view people and cultures in an abstract manner, then we tend to marginalize and diminish them. I’ve been guilty of that mistake at various times in my life. Accepting difference is one of the hardest things any of us ever have to do when our initial caveman response is “Me – Good! You not like me – Bad!”

Then there’s the inherent bias of western cultural superiority. Are my views automatically better just because I was brought up in a western culture? A fair chunk of the world’s population doesn’t seem to agree with that position. (To be clear, in no way, shape, or form is that last statement an implicit approval of the institutional thuggery of portions of the KSA government. Murder is murder whether it is done by an individual or a government.)

With a few notable exceptions (sociopaths) we all have value. The hard part for most of us is overlooking the differences and finding the common ground. Maybe theme parks are one way to find that common ground, and considering that the KSA is willing to import an American experience like Six Flags maybe they’re trying to find the common ground.

To address the question of whether Intamin could ever bring those records back across the Atlantic, I would give it a decade or two . You have to remember how unreliable TT2 and Kinda Ka were/are. Who's to say the same won't be true for falcon's flight? So I think Intamin will take 10-15 years to refine their technology before they take it to America again.

Tim – if you actually believe yourself and your BS – Then by all means take your wife with you. Why not?

Could it be she has the morals and integrity you are soooooo lacking.

Ask yourself as a Hardcore Red GOP voter – What would Jesus do? Would be make the Women of the Middle East cover their faces and blame them for getting raped… Make them be silent and walk 5 feet behind them.

They face high rates of domestic violence and many have to have permission to leave their home… Ask permission from their husband to leave the House? Are you kidding me.

Heck they must ask permission to get a Passport and forget traveling alone.

And this is what you will be supporting….

But hey I am just a Caveman according to you, correct?

Brian, I don’t think of you specifically as a caveman, but I am referring to the internal caveman response that we all have when encountering people of different appearance, behavior, and culture. If your internal caveman says “Ugh, me no like the value systems in some Middle Eastern countries!” for the very reasons that you’ve articulated, then that’s great! Your decision matrix gives you clear answers.

My decision matrix considers other factors, and in addition to the negative factors that you’ve outlined, I’m also trying to find the common ground. Is what we hear in the media truly accurate about most of the people in that culture? Are they as a culture making a gesture to us that they’re wanting rapprochement? Are my biases unfairly characterizing their culture? To me, the situation is complex and not easily defined.

As far as my wife goes, the answer is easy. She would never go with me because she hates rollercoasters, and she hates flying. If I were to experience this coaster it would be on a business trip where I could take a day or two of personal leave, and at this point in time with the perceptions that I have of the KSA, I would never plan an exclusive personal trip to the region. But I am willing to check things out if I had the opportunity just to see if my perceptions are valid and to ride that awesome coaster. Plus, my wife owes me. I’ve been watching the Hallmark Christmas in July movies with her for the past few days, and I think I’m developing diabetes as a result.

Anyway, you need to relax and keep enjoying those royalty checks from the Geico commercials. Donate some to the DNC. They need all the help they can get. Embrace your TDS – “Ugh! MAGA bad; ANTIFA good!” And thanks for making me smile again!

@VCfan... totally agree on time frame. And we are all waiting in anticipation of the answer to the real question .... "will it actually be a success"

Won't be long before we start to find out.

Tim - "we all have when encountering people of different appearance, behavior, and culture"

This is not culture and behavior - it is abuse to women.
They just let women have the right to drive in 2018..... WTF
Asking Permission to leave the House? Culture?
Covering a woman from Head to toe in 100 plus heat is culture?
Blaming a woman for getting raped, culture

Oh I get it, this is what you want from you wife, I assume.
I guess the Tim household word of the day is subservient.

This has nothing to do with the 'Merica' ways. It has to do with Human rights dumbass.

They used forced labor in Qatar to build a stadium for the world cup. Thousands from India and Pakistan were forced to build the stadium in 110 degree heat. Many died. And they don't care.

As I said - Remember 9/11 they came from Saudi Araba.
They will Not get a dime from the Vet.

But by all means go enjoy, maybe you will one of those who get jailed for 10 years over there for some made up charges. Maybe have a hand cut off because they think you stole.

You are an ignorant fool.

Engagement does not mean approval, Brian.

And please stop with the ridiculous insults, you've been an involved member on this website for a long time, and I'd hate to see you get banned.

I will always stick up for what is right. In this case a woman rights and the protection of this country from the terrorist's in the Middle east.

If I make a mistake - Robert will E-mail me and tell me about it.

And I will take a chance of a Permaban if it means telling the truth about those who want to support the behavior of the Saudis.

Engagement does mean approval. Tim.

Engagement = Money = approval.

I am using your own words against you and you do not like it. HAHAHAHAHA
Typical.

There is an Old saying - `Never wrestle with pigs. You both get dirty and the pig likes it'.

And like Monty Python's Black Knight, you always triumph.

Let's call it a draw.

I should be gentile on you Tim - Since your savior Lord Jesus Trumpleforeskin has Heart failure oops I mean the WH spin - Chronic Venous Insufficiency (CVI)..

You know I like you Tim and it is OK to battle.

Like I said I can't stand Saudi Arabia and the BS they do. heck I won't visit Texas with the regulations the put on Woman either and their stance on cannabis.

I don't use said product but half of the states have legal cannabis already.