Top Thrill Dragster: Is It Really The Highest and Fastest?
Cedar Point: Should a launch coaster be considered for a top-speed record? At what point is a launch ride no longer a roller *coaster*, but something else instead?
I think that this coaster should not be considered the fastest or tallest because it is launched, and you can reach unlimited speeds by launching. But there are many people who say that TTD will be the record holder, despite the fact that the coaster is launched. Your opinion?
From Anonymous
Posted March 4, 2003 at 12:19 PM
OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG
WTF WTF WTF WTF WTF WTF
UNF UNF UNF UNF UNF UNF
Why should it not be considered the tallest and fastest? It's still a roller coaster right? The train will reach a height of 420 feet and will launch at speeds of 120 MPH, which as far as I know is the tallest fastest in the world. Records are records, and as long as it's an hones to goodness roller coaster, then that's good enough for me. Just becuase a manufactuer figured out a way to go taller and faster without using gravity doesn't mean that it's still not a roller coaster. There will still be other records for indiviual categories. Superman: The Escape was the speed and height record holder for a long time, and most people didn't to seem to have too much of a problem with it, they just made up new records to decribe their "record breaking" coasters(Tallest on the east coast, fasted in North America, tallest fastest most-inverted coaster).
I doubt anyone will build a non-launched coaster over 400 ft, because it's just not feasible. Even with the cable lift, Millenium Force takes up a huge amount of space, and most parks do not have the real estate to devote to 400 ft rides without a launch.
What's interesting to me is that a roller coaster should, well, coast.
If a ride is launched, how much "coasting" must that ride do to be considered a roller coaster? Because if a ride isn't coasting for a significant part of its duration, at some point it becomes a track ride.
A really freakin' fast track ride, but a track ride nevertheless.
I don't know if TTD falls under that definition. Or Xcelerator, or SFMM's Superman. But its reasonable to suggest that some roller coasters are mutating into another type of ride.
I have thought the same things. MM calls Superman a coaster, but I sure don't. It's a fancyass tower ride. And I have problems with a lot of these mega/hyper/whatever coasters that just take you up and drop you and that is the most important part of the ride. YAWN. You know, I can do round-and-round on all kinds of other rides in the park. Roller coasters should have more than one element that grabs you. And making you almost black out doesn't qualify.
Here's a definition of a roller coaster: anything that runs on rails and is in PART powered by gravity. Therefore, Xcelerator, Top Thrill Dragster, and Superman are all coasters.
And Russell...they will build a non-launched 400+ feet coaster someday. Maybe not this year, but someday. And, by the way, as you probably might know, a non-launched 400+ feet coaster was planned for Heide Park in Germany this year, but was canceled.
How about that proposed (and shot down by locals) 700 foot coaster along the side of the Stratosphere? In Robert's #1 town, Las Vegas, Nevada!
That would be something great! Kind of like Big Shot ontop of the Stratosphere... only attraction never given it's due!!! Night time rides, simply the best...
When people come off that ride crying, and scared white... you know you have a great ride! Only wish this attraction was given a little more credit!!!
I feel it's okay to call it a roller coaster. Let Cedar Point have their record.
At night you can hear people screaming from the top of the Stratosphere, so I don't see how something closer to the ground will EVER get approved. And rightly so. This isn't the rest of the Strip. This end is surrounded by neighborhoods. Anything much higher than the spike on Speed and those screams will travel.
that is a good point...however superman the escape at magic mountain was for years recognized as the fastest...and it isnt even a continuous circuit. In our desire to push the envelope, we need new methods to get there. Can you imagine a traditional style coaster going 125mph? Thats probably about a 450 lift hill, and then what are you going to do after that? Many of the elements in todays coasters at their current design I'm sure would be out of the question due to g forces. To make a traditional coaster of that size and magnitude at this time would probably be a logistical nightmare...not to mention a financial one. Don't get me wrong... I hope for all our sakes that they can build it someday, but while Top Thrill isnt a traditional coaster, this is 2003, not 1989. Times have changed
I also have doubts that it is in fact a "roller coaster". But what ever it is I for one can't wait to ride it.
It has track(the exact same type of track as many other Intamin AG coasters), it has wheels that lock around the track, it uses gravity...What more do you want? I think there's not doubt this is a roller coaster. Just because a ride uses a launch mechanism to provide the initial potential energy instead of gravity, the ride cannot be discounted as a roller coaster. In addition, at least this one is a complete circuit coaster, not a shuttle.
I support Cedar Point on TTD, the right is unique, if not original due to Xcelerator, fast, 125mph, tall, 420ft and has many elements, twist on the way down and tophat as well as a great launch. CP deserve the title, for such an impressive capital investment in one year, oh and thanks Intamin, for another beast!
The argument against TTD being a roller coaster seems to be a bit silly, in my mind. The ride has only a couple of elements to it -- a rather large descent of 400', a 270 degree twist on the way down that rather large descent. I believe that the laws of gravity will indeed come into play after the train reaches the crest of the tophat (it will be traveling 5 - 15 MPH at that point which is quite similar to top of the main hill for other coasters). I believe that the train will begin "coasting" down hill and accelerate (due to the force of gravity)up to a speed of over 120 MPH. Said train will then continue on its track "circuit" back to the station. Cedar Point had several options available to get the train to the top of the tophat. The first option was the conventional "chain" hill. This would taken about sixty seconds or so...at a speed of about 10 MPH. The second option was the "elevator cable lift" hill that is employed on Millenium Force. This would have cut the ascent down to about 40 seconds or so. The final option was to use a "launch system" (there were different options on the type) hill which cuts the ascent down to about 8 seconds. While one could argue as to which of those three methods of getting the train to the top before COASTING back to earth is the best, the fact remains that the train is COASTING down a TRACK back to the station. Once again, sounds like a roller coaster to me. By the way, I haven't heard this argument about the Incredible Hulk. Doesn't it use a catapult propulsion system to get the train up??? Just curious...
Me personally, I think that people are starting to get jealous that Cedar Point has the biggest coaster now. For one thing I think its because they've just about always held rcords for the tallest coasters from Magnum XL 200 to Millenium Force and noe Top Thrill Dragster. I can sort of understand about it being a launch coaster and all, but a coaster is a coaster. So let them have their record and there is no need to even feel jealous, because if a park wants to beat their record, they'll do it. like the other guy said a lot of parks don't have the room for a traditional coaster especially one that reaches heights over 400 ft.
Maybe when or if you go to ride it you might think differently when it opens.
To Brian:
Cedar Point has held 4 height records. Gemini at 125 feet, Magnum XL-200 at 205 feet*, Millennium Force at 310 feet, and now Top Thrill Dragster at 420 feet. Heide Park was planning on a non-launched coaster above 400 feet, but it was cancelled. I know that you know all of this, but you left out Gemini.
*Magnum is really 200 feet, but the weather vane on top of the lift hill is 5 feet tall, making Magnum officially 205 feet.
From Ben Mills
Posted March 7, 2003 at 1:40 PM
HP's 400+ was gonna be either a hyper or a giga. Just to let you know.
New article by me http://www.themeparkinsider.com/news/response.cfm?ID=1009
Also, original article (I swear) here: http://www.themeparkinsider.com/news/response.cfm?ID=1010
From Anonymous
Posted March 8, 2003 at 10:28 AM
I think we should all forget the competition between all rides and just have fun! After all they're out there for our amusement!
I think top speed for a coaster should be defined as its GRAVITY powered run (top speed on its way down the hill). Does TTD reach 120mph during the LAUNCH or on the way down the hill?
I don't care how it gains the speed. It's a totally different type of ride. I've been on the Xcelerator at Knott's and that's a launch mechanism. Realizing it's not an 85mph drop, but that's not the point. I was terrified the first time on Xcelerator. It's 82mph and 205 foot high. Can you imagine the G-force on a 120mph take off, and trying to climb a 400 foot hill ? No way dude ! Whether it stays in the record books or not, I know it will be considered one of the scariest thrill rides in the states. Cedar Point wants to remain on the top.
Top speed is exactly that, the ride's top speed, whether it occurs at the beginning or end of the ride. It should have nothing to do with whether the ride is going up or down, just the highest speed the ride attains.
What about the "High Roller" coaster (Stratosphere Tower in Las Vegas? You take a 70mph elevator to the top, but the coaster itself only goes 25mph. :-)
Seriously, we will contiue to see high-speed lift mechanisms which are "part of the ride" but not "part of the coaster". Maybe we should state a coaster's "lift" speed and it's maximum "coast" speed.
Does anybody know the maximum speed for TTD (or Superman The Escape)on its descent (coast) run?
From Anonymous
Posted March 13, 2003 at 8:45 PM
I don't see how anyone can deny that TTD is a roller coaster. It may not be the traditional one, but never the less, it is a roller coaster. Also, on the record breaking issue. The ride's top speed and height are bigger than any other ride on earth, so how could it not be a record breaker? Personally, i am looking forward to riding this amazing record breaking coaster.
From Anonymous
Posted March 13, 2003 at 8:45 PM
I don't see how anyone can deny that TTD is a roller coaster. It may not be the traditional one, but never the less, it is a roller coaster. Also, on the record breaking issue. The ride's top speed and height are bigger than any other ride on earth, so how could it not be a record breaker? Personally, i am looking forward to riding this amazing record breaking coaster.
From Anonymous
Posted March 13, 2003 at 8:45 PM
I don't see how anyone can deny that TTD is a roller coaster. It may not be the traditional one, but never the less, it is a roller coaster. Also, on the record breaking issue. The ride's top speed and height are bigger than any other ride on earth, so how could it not be a record breaker? Personally, i am looking forward to riding this amazing record breaking coaster.
From Anonymous
Posted March 13, 2003 at 8:51 PM
sorry about the 3 post thing. whoops
I am looking foward to it also, I just am wondering if a ride should be a record breaker where all the builders did was move a little piece of machinery to get a ride boosted up to 120 mph. It doesn't seem fair.
Per the Cedar Point Website, TTD will reach 120MPH twice...on launch and on the Drop...
From Anonymous
Posted March 18, 2003 at 6:41 PM
It is a real rollercoaster you do 2 inversions and "coast" all through the ride. If that is not a roller coaster then neither is The Hulk and Im a die-hard IOA fan.TTD is a roller coaster and deserves the record.
From Anonymous
Posted March 18, 2003 at 8:01 PM
The Rock and Roll coaster is a launch based ride and Disney proclaims it is the only roller coaster in its parks that inverts three times. I have riden this ride many times and give it the same thrill rating I do to the Hulk at Islands antother launch based). So if we accord the title of coasters to these rides then the same should go to TTD. Hats off to Cedar Point for creating this ride.
TTD does no inversions.
This attraction will be trend-settting!! (already is) but for the better, or for the worse?
Interesting to see what happens.
From Anonymous
Posted March 19, 2003 at 7:27 PM
Yes, it is a coaster, And I am all about it. So for all of you who don't think that it is breaking a record fairly, you're just pissed that someone closer to you didn't think of it first. :P
I'm all about it also. I just have a different idea than you.
Jeff Arons
-When it comes to height, Top Thrill Dragster takes the cake
From Anonymous
Posted April 12, 2003 at 11:19 AM
I think it should still be the tallest and fastest regardless if it is launched or dropped from a chain or elevator life.
From Anonymous
Posted April 12, 2003 at 11:20 AM
THIS IS THE FASTEST AND TALLEST DEFINITLY! I CANT WAIT TO GO ON IT! I AM GOING THE OPENING DAY ON MAY 4!! TOP THRILL DRAGSTER IS DEFINITLY IN THE RECORD BOOKS!!!!!!!!!
Well, technically, this is the tallest and fastest. But it is too bad... The coaster is extremely short, containing one hill and one drop ...
Eh Kev -- too bad Universal didn't get to a project like this first, eh? Then maybe the ride would be long, maybe with themeing. Although I like Disney, they're not exactly ... coaster people ...
From Anonymous
Posted April 16, 2003 at 2:17 PM
I do consider it a roller coaster. I will never ride it, though, no matter how much I love coasters. I can't imagine what the brain is gonna go through(besides the back of your head) when you're launched at 120mph!
And it's only gonna be a matter of time before Japan or one of those countries steals the record from CP...although I really don't see what they could possible build that would be higher and faster without somebody dying...personally, TTD is on the verge of really pushing the envelope...I just hope it's a safe ride and that nobody gets hurt. Hey, RIDE AT YOUR OWN RISK BABY!
From Anonymous
Posted April 21, 2003 at 1:01 PM
It is most definetly a roller coaster because it is a full circuit coaster, right? Now superman at SFMM isn't a coaster, more like a free-fall ride. See, dragster might be very short and a launch coaster, but it still is a full circuit coaster.
From Anonymous
Posted April 24, 2003 at 1:50 PM
Nope it's not a coaster.
No question, all it is is a launch and a hyper-exaggerated turnaround. Xlerator at Knotts is a coaster, becuase it is more than just a launch and turnaround. But TTD, it's just an oval!
Jason
From Anonymous
Posted April 25, 2003 at 1:45 PM
I think TTD is still a coaster even given the fact that it is launched. My definition of a roller coaster is something that rides on rails, is powered by gravity, and follows a circuit.
From Anonymous
Posted April 29, 2003 at 1:32 PM
OMG why are u arguiing about this it is a roller coaster, it goes up, and down, and back to the station it is gonna b the greatest COASTER of the age but im not gonna say ever bc i know CP will build bigger and better than ttd if you think it isnt than ur just jealous that i live down the road from CP and you dont CP is bigger and better than any other park in the world they always come out bigger and better than anyone in the world and if anyone trys to step up to them CP will just tottaly overpower that park bc the ideas they come up w/ are genuis with what to build when and where in the park bc if ur at the park they really have to move things to jam things in together it is really amazing on how much is in that park w/ what room they have
From Anonymous
Posted May 1, 2003 at 6:38 PM
I went on it today and it is a badass mofo! But...it lasts exactly 20 seconds. I timed it.
It is very fast. It is very tall. You don't, however, do a lot of coasting.
The Millenium Force is still the better ride.
I can't wait to ride this coaster and yes it is a coaster unlike StupidMan at Six Flags.
I'm riding TTD tomorrow; will let y'all know what happens!
From Anonymous
Posted May 4, 2003 at 1:45 PM
Cedar Point is and will always be the greatest park on the planet. And anyone who gets jealous of them is stupid because unlike six flags, universal and disney, they aren't sellouts with astronomical budgets. They are devoted to making the most badass rides on the planet and they don't take crap from anyone, especially the king of sellout rides, superman. I've gone to Cedar Pont almost every year of my life because I'm from Cleveland. I feel blessed and I laugh at everybody that's a six flags junkie. TTD once again proves there's only one man of a park and the rest are little commercial babies. Long live Cedar Point!!
From Anonymous
Posted May 4, 2003 at 3:31 PM
Why should it not be considered the tallest and fastest? It's still a roller coaster right? The train will reach a height of 420 feet and will launch at speeds of 120 MPH, which as far as I know is the tallest fastest in the world. Records are records, and as long as it's an hones to goodness roller coaster, then that's good enough for me. Just becuase a manufactuer figured out a way to go taller and faster without using gravity doesn't mean that it's still not a roller coaster. There will still be other records for indiviual categories. Superman: The Escape was the speed and height record holder for a long time, and most people didn't to seem to have too much of a problem with it, they just made up new records to decribe their "record breaking" coasters(Tallest on the east coast, fasted in North America, tallest fastest most-inverted coaster).
I doubt anyone will build a non-launched coaster over 400 ft, because it's just not feasible. Even with the cable lift, Millenium Force takes up a huge amount of space, and most parks do not have the real estate to devote to 400 ft rides without a launch.
I AGREE! TO THIS ALREADY MADE STATEMENT!
From Anonymous
Posted May 4, 2003 at 3:34 PM
Gawd, this argument is needless. We KNOW that TTD is a roller coaster, we KNOW that it is the tallest at 420 feet, and we know that it is the fastest at 120 mph. If it is launched or is pulled up by chain, and if it coasts, it's a roller coaster. There you have it.
Less then 5 years something will top this ride. And so on...anyone notice a trend?=)
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